English 1301 students:
For our Friday, October 26, blog, please post a comment of at least two well-developed paragraphs about William Zinsser's "College Pressures" (450-459 in our textbook) and William Deresiewicz's very controversial article about elite colleges (link: "Don't Send Your Kid to the Ivy League.") Click on the article link, read it, and then answer these two questions in your comment:
1. How, according to Deresiewicz, have college pressures at Yale University and other hyper-competitive universities changed since 1979, the year Zinsser wrote his essay?
2. Citing Zinsser and Deresiewicz, discuss whether your own Angelo State University pressures fall into the same categories as the students' pressures described in the two essays or whether they fall into different categories. How do our college pressures stack up next to Yale students' pressures?
After you post your comment, please reply in one well-developed paragraph to at least one of the other students' comments.
For Monday, please read pp. 460-65 before coming to class, and please be sure to bring your textbook to class on both Monday and Wednesday.
Have a great weekend,
Dr. K
Colleges have changed from only boys or girls only to co ed. We have more financial aid, and money has almost decreased in value since then. The college now embraces diversity and segregation and other racial inequalities are gone from ASU. The Colleges never embraces extracurricular activities as they do now. Now we also have our family members pay for our bills here sometimes and our classes can stack up tremendously. There's more people around to get bothered by and you have to be really social to enjoy being at ASU. Every hour here would need about 2 hours of work outside of class. Also, we have tons of things now to go to that are mandatory rather than optional.
ReplyDeleteThe whole aspect of going to college during their times, was just work and no play. The colleges then weren't half as full as it is now too. People back then were probably huge douches when interacted with since they probably wouldn't want to be bothered. Then classes could end up being about half as the ones needed now. Also, we have so much help from the staff here, back then you were out of luck if you were confused.
yeah a lot of colleges today allow co ed instead of separating the boy and the girls. You are definitely right that financial aid has increased over the years, and money has decreased in value. And most colleges are very diverse when it comes to the students. Colleges do have a lot more extracurricular activities today then back then. Back in the day College was nothing but hard work and like you said that most colleges like ASU is a lot more social. I don't know if people back in the day where bad people when they interact with each other. It is very true that there are a lot more classes in universities today then back then. And we do have more access to more help then college students back in the day.
DeleteCollege pressures have changed from being less expensive to , too expensive to handle at this point. Students go to school full time and also work to pay off their studies which leads to less time on school work which adds more stress.
ReplyDeleteAt Angelo State i can say that i feel the same way but im also surrounded by a staff and school who is here to help. Most Universitys now a days will have multiple recources for help.
I like that you said college is too expensive to handle these days. I agree and I think that is a huge reason why so many people either don't attend college at all or end up dropping out. Even with dropping out at student is most likely in debt after their first semester. So that definetly does add stress.
DeleteI also agree as well. College is becoming a lot more expensive since a lot more people are trying to get higher paying jobs. It has now basically become a norm for most average Americans. To be honest, I wouldn't be surprised if it becomes a requirement in the future.
DeleteI also agree that college is becoming more of a challenge due to the fact that it is too expensive and also that you have to work just to pay it off. It becomes too much to handle at times, especially when you go to school full time and also wok full time.
DeleteAccording to Deresiewicz, Yale University has changed a lot over the years. He said that most students that attends Yale come from high privileged families. He says in the essay, in 1984 46 percent of incoming freshmen come from top quarter of income distribution. And then it jumped to 55 percent in the year 2000. He also says that Yale is looking for students that have a lot of experience in their major. The example he uses is a student that went to Italy for a mouth to study the Renaissance is more likely to be accepted into Yale. Deresiewicz also says that the students themselves have changed too. He says that the students have levels of toxic fear, anxiety, and depression under the well-adjusted facade.
ReplyDeleteThe pressure that I experienced in ASU do fall under some of the pressures in both essays. One of the pressures that I can relate to is self-pressure. I mostly work myself to the bone and it causes me to stress out a lot. Sometimes I also stress myself out when I ask myself what will happen in the future or if I will be successful in the future. Another pressure I can relate to is that I need to gain experience on my major. I find it very hard to find time to do volunteer work at a job I want to have in the future. It stresses me out that most places in the world today require you to have experience. I think The pressure I have don't come close to the Pressure that of the students that go to Yale have because Yale is extremely competitive university.
According to Deresiewicz, hyper-competitive universities still remain in place and even got worse since Zinsser wrote his essay. Students are still suffering from their grade and competition pressure. Deresiewicz criticized those hyper-competitive and commercial university. He thought that the first thing that college is for is to teach you to think, not teach you to how to get a better job. He also states that students should refuse to be impressed by any opportunity that was enabled by parental wealth.
ReplyDeleteI think my pressures as an Angelo State University student fall into the same categories as the students’ pressures described in the two essays. I feel pressures about a grade, future job, economic problem, and my parents’ expectations as students in the two essays. However, I think my pressures are not that severe so much in comparison to Yale students’ pressures. I totally agree with what Zinsser says “there is no one right way to get ahead – that each of them is a different person, starting from a different point and bound for a different destination.” Hyper-competitive universities make students so fearful of risk and so goal obsessed at such an early age.
I agree with what you're saying about having the pressures at school because of the same reasons presented in the essays, because I myself also struggle with them.
DeleteYale University and other Ivy League University's have changed over the years according to Deresiewicz. He talk about how a little less than half of the freshman attending Yale University are from the top quarter of income. Now, its over half so that's is a change in the university. The students at the University are changing too and not for the better. Deresiewicz explains how more and more students at Yale University are dealing with stress and depression.
ReplyDeleteI would say the pressures that I experience at ASU definitely relate to the pressures of students at Yale University. Class is very stressful. It is a big step up from high school academics. You have work in multiple classes everyday and sometimes you just don't know how to do the work. School is very time consuming and stressful and I think it is because it is my freshman year and it will probably be the hardest year.
Dalton Timmons
DeleteI can see how class can be very stressful at times and this is a way I relate to some pressures at ASU. College is a whole new world compared to high school. I have had similar situations where sometimes in class I flat out do not know the content or what is going on. Time management is important and just adds on to the stress. I agree that this being my freshman year, it will most likely be the most difficult as well.
1. I do not really see many changes in the pressures on college students between the two essays. Both the more recent essay and the one from 1979 seem to have very similar pressures and the pressures seem to have extremely similar effects on students. The pressure from parents making students less motivated and excited for college and the pressure of having to pay for college making students stress show up in both essays and are both very true to this day.
ReplyDelete2. I feel like many college pressures boil down to many of the same things no matter what college a student attends but one thing that stuck out to me as being more difficult at an Ivy League rather than ASU would be admissions. As both Zinsser and Deresiewicz state getting into an Ivy League depends on what a student looks like on paper rather than what a person is like in paper. While I believe this is true to an extent at any college I definitely think a person has to look a lot better on paper to get into an Ivy League than to ASU. As Zinsser states there is a lot of money that goes into being into an Ivy League school that although student loans can be stressful here at ASU they cannot compare to an Ivy League. The pressures of being at an Ivy League I think are much more than those that come with going to ASU.
I totally agree with your opinion. It’s a good point that you said many college pressures boil down to many of the same things no matter what college a student attend. I also agree with that the pressure from parents making students less motivated and excited for college and the pressure of having to pay for college making students stress show up in both essays and are both very true to this day. It’s a serious problem that hyper-competitive universities still remain in place and even got worse.
DeleteCollege Pressures have changed tremendously over the years. Students now have a fear and anxiety of well adjusted facade according to Deresiewicz. They also have changed from males being the only ones to go to college to females attending as well. They now have co Ed colleges rather than just having a college specific to men or women. Over the time, colleges have been more a financial issue. Back then, colleges never thought that extracurricular activities were impressive. Instead, they wanted students with more of an academic study focus. They also looked for students that experienced a lot in their own major. He also also said that most students that attends Yale come from high privileged families. He also states that the percent of imcoming freshmen come the top quarter in their class jumped from 46 to 55 percent.
ReplyDeleteI can say that I fall under these pressures here at ASU. I stress a lot over my grades that mean to me. To get into the nursing program, you need to make at least a B in all of your science classes. I also tend to stress over quizzes and exams and study until feel my brain fried afterwards. Meanwhile, the help that I have here from the professors and staff, gets me over these pressures I have. However, I don’t think i come close to the pressure toward students at Yale.
According to Deresiewicz, nothing has changed really about colleges. They still pressure kids to only get good grades and to be pressuring themselves for no reason. College students want a straight path and can’t imagine what it means to follow your heart and not the degree plan. Many students still go to college for a higher paying job because mom and dad think down upon people who become philosophers instead of doctors. The students these days just want to graduate. They see college as a path to the rest of their lives. Instead of using college as a start to the rest of their lives.
ReplyDeleteFor my own pressures as a college student they tend to relatively fall into the same pressures as the two authors discuss. As discussed by Zinsser he sees, “four different kinds of pressure working on college students today: economic pressure, parental pressure, peer pressure, and self-induced pressure.” Coming to college four hours away from home can be even harder because I want to make my family proud. I have always been one to pressure myself more than anyone else. For us I feel like our pressures are different from those of Yale students. At Yale you have to be the best and you are always competing with the best. Here at ASU we have a wide range of students, but yet we are still always competing with each other to out study or get a better grade than others. It’s sad really that we can’t just feel relaxed enough to be at college to expand our minds. No matter what college isn’t about just being creative or learning who you are and what you want. It is going into to college supposedly already knowing who you are and what you want. Yeah right!
I agree with you in the sense that students are brought up to believe that college is the time in our lives when we get to learn the individuals we strive or hope to be. Yet i think the momentum is at a faster rate that more of us get caught up in the flow of getting work after work done and choosing classes throughout our degree plan that wen don't ever get to reach the level of where our hearts belong. Despite what kind of pressure each student feels it all still falls under the category of pressure.
DeleteI totally agree with your reply. I think colleges sill do pressure students to excel at getting an A. Compared to other other colleges we have different standards but then again we all know to do our best.
DeleteAfter reading the essay, it is easily translated that Deresiewicz believes the education system at the higher level has changed more in the sense that learning how to be an outstanding student has been more of a priority than actually being an outstanding student. Back then the higher level of education was seen as the opportunity to expand your mindset in order to take you to a higher way of thought and professions. Now students are bombarded with intense tasks assigned that are mandatory from the standards that are being asked of them. Not allowing them to take the time to really process things and experience them towards a path of true intellectual growth. Instead it's just preparation to be successful in today's economy.
ReplyDeleteIn my own outlook towards the lifestyle between what we have just read from Yale students versus what I have just witnessed and experienced here with my time at Angelo State, I do believe all students fall under the category of the stress that comes along with attending college. Yet Angelo State varies more with the amount of students they allow to attend than that of Yale. Yale is on a greatly higher level of acceptance meaning the students that go there are on that higher level. Not to downgrade ASU or the students that attend here but if we honestly take a look we can easily and faster spot a student who barely did any work to be here and students who give everything they have towards the standards of higher education in general.
I agree with that. College has become entirely focused on making the best grades possible and becoming the student with the best GPA. College used to be a place where the student could explore different career paths and enjoy college. Now if you even think about trying to enjoy yourself it is considered to be the worst thing you could do.
DeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteIn William Deresiewicz's article he says that college has changed in the way students perceive it. He states that students in this age are more terrified of not being successful than anything else. He says when he went to college kids bounced around and tried a little of everything to see what they liked and what they could be happy with doing for their career. In our age kids go into pre-med, pre-law, pre-etc, or as he said someone put it "pre-rich" because that is what their parents want and since their parents are paying for it they want to make their parents happy but it isn't what they want to study.
ReplyDeleteI do not particularly have any pressures here at ASU at least not in a sense of wanting to make my parents happy. I do have the same pressure to be successful and be able to have a good future but I also want to be happy with my choice I just hope I make the right one. I wouldn't say that the pressures are the same but they are very similar for most people in our age and I feel that it will just get worse in the future to be honest.
ReplyDeleteDalton Timmons (Had to use a friends computer, mine was updating)
Hyper-competitive universities still exist and continue to get worse since Zinsser wrote his essay. Deresiewicz state that most Yale attendees come from privileged families. The increase in this from 1984 to 2000 went from 46 percent to 55 percent of students who attended coming from the top quarter of income distribution. This is tough because he believes students should primarily be in the college setting to learn as opposed to going to college just for a higher income job. The students that attend Yale are under the pressure of their families more because they are expected to succeed at the highest level since they are being put through one of the highest level schools in the country. The parents or families of these students expect more since the financial gap between Yale and other universities is so large.
The pressures that Yale students face are similar in some ways to the pressures we deal with at ASU. The self pressure is the biggest concern for myself as I have high expectations for my life. This is the pressure I can most closely relate to because at ASU I pressure myself to do the best that I can in each course and be on time to all of my classes. The pressure that is different for me is the pressure from parents or family members. My college was not as expensive and my parents didn’t have to pay for much so they don’t hassle me to stay on top of things. The pressure does affect me in a way that drives me to work harder. My parents may not pressure me, but I pressure myself to make them proud.
Not much has really changed when it comes to a lot of colleges, according to Deresiewicz. College students are usually quite stressed when it comes to being pressured to do homework and study. Because of this, it makes the upcoming students a lot less emphasized about college and much more fearful for it instead.
ReplyDeleteI have also fallen into a lot of pressures here at Angelo State University, for one, we get much more homework which means if I don't complete it, I will risk failing the class which I really do not want to happen. Another pressure is failing because everyone in my family has only been in college for 4 years and it puts a lot more pressure on me to try to compete with that but in reality it is a lot harder than it is told.
From the time that Deresiewicz wrote this article and Zinsser wrote this essay Ivy leagues have had drastic changers. Yale used to be considered one of the best schools to send your child too if you could afford it. Now yale is viewed as institution you send your child to, if you want to kill their soul. The pressure put on these students is extreme. With so many projects and deadlines it’s no wonder they feel like they’re dead on the inside. These Ivy League schools used to be tough on the students, but it still allowed them to have a life and actually enjoy college. Nowadays college is the student’s full time job, and on top of that they actually have jobs they need to attend to pay off the massive loan debts they acquire from the ridiculous amount of tuition and fees.
ReplyDeleteAt Angelo state we have similar deadlines as those of ivy league students. However they might not be as extreme as those who attend an ivy league school. “...they can follow unswervingly to career security, financial security, and, presumably, a prepaid grave”( Zinsser pg 451). In this excerpt the author is talking about how he knows that all students are focusing on is what will make them the most money if college doesn't kill them first. Students used to be focused on exploring life when they went to college. Now its study as hard as you can and if you don’t get an “A”, you’re a failure. With this mentality it is sure to make a generation of angry parents who will then instill these values in their children and repeat the cycle.
After reading the essay, Deresiewicz thinks school has had various changes throughout time.Generally speakings, most priorities are the same in schools are the same and follow the same patterns and structure.In the article he explains how students are worried about being successful rather than acknowledging what there doing. This is sure to cause students more pressure and bring them stress trying to perfect everything they do.
ReplyDeleteObviously, Angelo state and Yale University are two very diverse colleges so in comparison there is a bit to cover. Yale University has higher standards is going to expect more out of there students than Angelo state due to the requirements of getting accepted.However, i think most students here can agree that we all strive to get an A but if something negative or pressures consumes us then we perform with lesser standards. Here at Angelo, we are encouraged to do great things but the pressure to excel isn't as great as expected.
yes, college Pressures have changes because colleges have changed, not only in the sense of prices but, getting an education at the higher level now compared to Back then, is that they're now co ed and women get the opportunity to go to college as well. There is also now a big change in the amount of stress college students go to. its due to all the deadlines and stress that Comes with being a student.
ReplyDeleteI think the pressures at ASU are similar in the pressures about a grads and deadlines. these cause a lot of stress and school if starting to be a huge responsibility to take on and I can see how Yale and Ivy Leagues can have it rough. However, I think that the pressures associate with being at ASU are no where as close to "severe" and demanding as the Yale students’ pressures.
I totally agree that being a student at ASU does not compare to Yale's students. Yale puts way more pressure on students than ASU since it is an elite school and it is much bigger. They require students to have a high GPA in order to be accepted. In contrast, ASU is not as demanding and students are surrounded by people who are willing to help them in any way they can to be successful in their courses. So overall, ASU students don't face as much pressure as Yale students.
DeleteIn the article "Don't Send Your Kid to the Ivy League" says that most colleges are the same because they all put pressure on the students no matter what. Students always feel pressure during college because of the amount of homework they get or even pressured by their parents because they have gone to college and is implying you have to go to. But to compare Angelo State and Yale, they are the same but different I mean one is a D2 school while the other one is a top of the line school. It puts a lot of pressure on seniors of high school to go to college because they see how stressed college students are and they don't want that for themselves.
ReplyDeleteColleges have change in so many ways since 1979. Students are not so worried about competing with each other now. They focus more on themselves, and rather worry if they are doing enough to pass their courses. In the 1970’s the amount of people who attended college does not compare to the numbers today nor the price of tuition and fees. The cost for someone to further their education at a university has extremely increase since 1979 and is probably the most obvious way in how colleges have changed since. Today students have more opportunities in ways to pay for college for example, grants and scholarships. In addition, the universities today support and help students when they need help in their classes simply by going to tutor centers. In contrast to the 1970’s colleges like Angelo State support the idea of diversity that include race, religion, and ethics.
ReplyDeleteAngelo State University pressures that I have experienced fall into the same categories as the students’ pressures described in the two essays. I usually pressure myself so much in certain courses that I am currently taking that leads to stress and anxiety. In addition, I wonder if my effort is good enough for an “A”. The pressure of graduating and becoming successful afterwards is what many students including myself relate to very often. Also, another pressure I experience is if my current major is the right one for me. I certainly don’t want to end up working in a job that I do not enjoy. The pressures at ASU does not even compare to Yale student’s pressures. Since Yale is an elite school and is much bigger than ASU students are faced to compete with each other in order to get accepted. As an ASU student I can say that there are many people who are willing to help me in any questions I have in my assignments which helps me to not feel as pressured.
This comment has been removed by the author.
DeleteI agree that while being at Angelo state university I have experienced many pressures that come with homework and exams but Yale's pressures exceed by a lot.
DeleteI agree that being at Angelo state I have felt stressed and pressured, but Yale's pressure would be way more extreme
DeleteDeresiewicz writes about how institutions like Harvard, Stanford, Williams have students that attend the institution that do not even know why they are going through with it. The majority of students who attend these schools are children of the upper class population who want their children to go to the best because it’s simply the best. Where as in the past higher education was not that emphasized as being important. When they did go to college it was something they had thoroughly thought out because it took a lot to do to be able to go, it was not taken for granted like it somewhat is now.
ReplyDeleteDeresiewicz states that a students said “ Well, my parents want me to be a doctor. They’re paying all this money and…” which in my case I can understand that because some days are worse than others. Sometimes I forget why I am even here or why I even go here but I know that is just me being homesick. Other days I feel like I have to do my best for my parents, not even for myself but for them which should not be the way it goes. Zinsser said to “look beneath the facade of seamless well-adjustment, and what you often find are toxic levels of fear, anxiety and depression, of emptiness and aimlessness and isolation” which doesn’t really apply to me so much but I do find myself really down at times and feeling like I need to be by myself in order to get things done.
I agree; I think some students are motivated to do well in college mainly because they are afraid of disappointing their parents, or maybe even simply because their parents are helping to pay for it. I think it is interesting that you said that shouldn't be the way it goes. Do you think trying not to disappoint your parents should not be a motivating factor? And if so, why? What do you think students should be motivated by?
DeleteI agree, many of the elite children have no idea why they are going to an Ivy League for anything other than to be a legacy or because it’s the “best”. This seems like a real waste of spots for kids who have wanted this their entire lives. Of kids who dream of going and will struggle through to pay it all. This is vastly different from the past when this higher education was not as important to everyone. College then was not taken for granted. It was special and something taken with the utmost sincerity.
DeleteDeresiewicz says, Yale University has changed a lot over the years. He said that most students that attends Yale come from high privileged families. As said in the essay, in 1984 46 percent of incoming freshmen come from top quarter of income distribution. And then it went up to 55 percent in the year 2000. Deresiewicz also says that Yale is looking for students that have a lot of experience in their major. The example he uses is a student that went to Italy for a month to study the Renaissance is more likely Yale to accept them. Deresiewicz also says that the students themselves have changed too. He says that the students have levels of fear, anxiety, and depression under the well-adjusted facade.
ReplyDeleteThe pressure that I experienced in ASU was during the fall I was under some of the pressures in both essays. One of the pressures that I can relate to is self-pressure. I mostly work myself to the bone and it causes me to stress out a lot. Sometimes I also stress myself out when I ask myself what will happen in the future or if I will be successful in the future. Another pressure I can relate to is that I need to gain experience on my major. I find it very hard to find time to do volunteer work at a job I want to have in the future. It stresses me out that most places in the world today require you to have experience. I think the pressure I have don't come close to the pressure that of the students that go to Yale have because it is an extremely competitive university.
Well. Self-pressure is, unfortunately, likely the hardest to relieve. Parents and peers alike can just be ignored because, y'know, grown adults. Economic pressure is also very hard to eliminate but I would challenge that most of its weight comes from the self-induced pressure it generates. Seems to me you're pressuring yourself over future success. It might help to develop a precise, finely detailed definition of success and then shape what you do and how you spend your time accordingly. You could also always just change your definition of success as well. Don't like the rules of the game? Change them. Doing that also lets you set your own conditions for victory. On a more specific note regarding experience as a job requirement: change your definition of experience. Even if you can't always work directly within your major, non-technical and soft skills translate. Wal-mart greeter? Experience in dealing with a variety of different people while interacting with them in a polite, professional manner- also the basics like getting to work on time/time management, personal responsibility. Requisite for customer service, teamwork, personal etiquette in a professional setting. Experience is a very broad term and it often will come down to what you extract from it and how. Then it becomes a matter of how you present (sell) it to a hiring board or other HR personnel at a job interview. You have much freedom in how you can interact with the world- try to focus a bit on learning how to use it.
DeleteThe pressures from applying to a college like Yale is immense. Ivy League colleges are in completely different ballparks than schools like ASU. The admissions process alone is more intense and pointed, let alone the actual school if you somehow get in. Colleges are also almost all coed now and have far more diversity than they did in 1979. There is more financial aid available to students nowadays, and the value of money as sort of decreased. Classes in these times also have a lot of work that can really stack up. Take my friend Chevy for example- he is overcome with work from being a physics major and it is tearing his normally happy demeanor to shreds of despair and sleep deprivation.
ReplyDeleteNow, I wouldn’t go around comparing my workload to that of a Law major at Yale, but that does not mean it is easy. Workload from any amount of classes can become tiresome and excessive, which only makes the social lives we’re supposed to have even harder to maintain. I do understand very well the pressure of learning more for my major. Finding time to be able to go to a bio lunch or to a tri beta meeting is much more rough than I had imagined. Like I said, I wouldn’t compare my issues to that of an Ivy League student, but trying to get all A’s and do extra credit work for every class becomes too much.
I like that you pointed out that students' social lives are often one of the first things to suffer when students are overworked. I'm curious, where do you think this expectation comes from, that students should be involved in extra-curriculars, and making high grades, and still have a social life? Do you think that is a realistic expectation? I would also be curious to see if any research has been done about the correlation between social lives and students' well-being. Do you think a good social life is important for students' well-being?
DeleteSeveral things have changed in Ivy League schools, and schools across the country especially the factors of co ed and also prices. Students now have to work their way through colleges in order to be able to study and pass. It is harder for students to work when they have school full time and have to study as well.
ReplyDeleteAngelo State and Yale can be compared in the fact that they are both very nice schools, and also offer great education to their students. Many college students are worried about money, and the studies that they have to go through in order to pass and also to work, and Angelo State is the same with that however there are many staff members who are will to help and I say that that's where they can be the same as well.
I agree that Ivy League schools have changed over the years. Angelo State and Yale are also very similar to each other also.
DeleteMany things have changed in Ivy League schools and one of the main factors being that the majority of students who used to be admitted into these schools came from the more wealthier families, and now there is a change. Any student can get in to these schools as long as they have the grades, or academic skills to prove that they can be there.
ReplyDeleteFor me, the main struggles that I deal with would be the money portion of it and as well as the standards of needing my grades to be high enough. I have to keep my grades high enough to continue receiving my Angelo State scholarship, and for that reason the pressure that I had in the fall was just to keep my grades at a high enough standard. I feel that that is how it is over at any Ivy League school as well.
Deresiewicz says that he has seen a drastic change while working at Yale University over the years. He has noticed that students are putting less passion in the majors that they are studying in. They will choose a major that their parents pressure to enter them in even though they have a passion in another field. Deresiewicz also noticed that Yale has began to recently start prioritizing admitting students who already have some amount of experience in the career that they are admitting to the school for. This drastically reduces the admission rate.
ReplyDeleteThe most stressful experiences I have had while at ASU were whenever I had to take my Chemistry exams. That class is very important to me so that I can continue on my path to getting a degree in Nursing. So I have to spend many hours of the day studying. Another pressure I experience is maintaining at least a 3.0 GPA. I need at least a 3.0 GPA so I can earn the Carr scholarship and keep the Hazelwood Act. Both of these are my main payment sources for tuition.
I think you have pinpointed a concern that a lot of students have. Students from low-middle income families are probably far more concerned about their financial status than students at Ivy League schools. While students at a school like ASU might not have all the same social pressures that Ivy League students have, the pressure to maintain their financial is high. Do you think this can distract students in the same way that Deresiewicz students at Ivy League schools are distracted? Instead of focusing on getting the most out of college, do you think students become too focused on financial concerns?
DeleteThe essay shows that at Universities like Yale and other hyper-competitive Universities, there are four different kinds of pressures being put on college students. Those pressures are, economic pressure, parental pressure, peer pressure, and self-induced pressure. When Zinsser talks about economic pressure, he is referring to the cost of attending college and the struggle to pay for it. Next he talks about parental pressure, which is where parents are pushing their children to do a certain degree because it will give them financial security in the future. Although that degree they want the child to pursue is not the child’s passion. Then Zinsser goes on about peer pressure. He states this as people in college see their peers working and studying hard, and that person thinks they are falling behind when really their peer thinks that person is doing better than them. Lastly Zinsser talks about self-induced pressure. This means that students are becoming more concerned about their degree plans rather than life and living it.
ReplyDeleteI believe my main pressure is the economic pressure. The reason why is I’m attending college right now on my own funds with no outside help from anyone. In turn that means I also have to balance time between my school work and working a full time job to pay for next semester. Trying to do both is hard because, I have to keep my grades up in my classes and at the same time I have to sacrifice study time for work so I have a way to pay for next semester. Being a student at ASU though, I think is not even close to being as severe as Yale or the Ivy League student.
I believe you hit the main point of both essays. Most of the essays focuses on the high requirements that is needed for entering the college. The pressures also comes from students that focused too much into college that they forget that they need to apply it in the real world. I believe that you touched on these topic pretty well.
Deletehyper-competitive universities pressure has dramatically changed over the years, students now have stress and fear according to Deresiewicz. Students still fear of grade pressure and paying tuition which has gone up since 1979. Instead of focusing on expanding their learning, students now are stressed about failing because their parents want them to go, they are stressed about debt and if they fail it’s a waste of money.
ReplyDeleteAt Angelo state were like a competitive university’s because were still a college but it’s not near as extreme. I feel pressured to make sure I get good grades and do my work which stresses me out sometimes. I Always have to tell myself to keep going that I need to make good grades not only for my parents but for me because I want to be successful.
Though things are much the same, there are still differences resulting from the natural evolution of an old and distorted formula: Success = $$$ = High Paying Job = Super Fancy Degree. This formula apparently gained traction sometime in the 70s when higher education began to shift from the path of self-improvement and growth into a form of zero sum game revolving around $$$. Interestingly, I might posit that this rather nasty change is the result of skewed perception. The belief that an elite college degree was the launching point for success (and that success = $$$) by leading directly into a highly lucrative career eventually became the expectation. Where the original aim was once to grow as a person, it is now to grow as a wallet. The result is that while all the old pressures still exist they are now constricting younger and younger victims. Extracurriculars, studies abroad, private schooling, and tutoring are now the requisite to even dream of entering an elite school. Where students once had to stand out among their peers to succeed in college, they must now do so to even be considered for attending college. The grooming for $uccess also further inflates the already ballooning costs of a higher-tier degree. Generation after generation of students, born and bred to keep reaching toward a glass ceiling that gets higher and higher. In a way, it is a blessing that most of us will never be tall enough to reach- those that are sacrifice childhoods to align themselves to a predefined and very narrow path in life. Another unpleasant long term side effect is that as the belief became reality and permeated society, people began looking for shortcuts. Genuine hard work and a drive to do good became the appearance of hard work and a drive to look good. I suppose that this is the humorous result of a self-perpetuating cycle where a failure to recognize caricatures in people and education has resulted in education churning out people unable to recognize such caricatures.
ReplyDeleteWell. My schooling is paid for and I am very secure financially so economic pressure isn't a factor. My parents don't try to pressure me one way or the other about anything and never really have. Even if they did, I've lived apart from them for so long that it really just wouldn't work at this point. I've always been too focused on my own goals to care what the other kids are doing so peer pressure isn't a consideration. To be perfectly honest, I'm not trying nearly hard enough to feel any self-induced pressure (I say after spending over 3 hours on this blog entry, longer than writing some essays- then again, my definition of pressure is skewed). I've never wanted to go to an elite college so I have never tortured myself or mangled my childhood in the attempt. The pressure I do feel is related to how I would prefer to be starting in on my career right now but I need a degree first. While I am a patient man, I'm not such a young man that I can afford to stall building the life I want for 4 years without feeling some discomfort over it.
One change in college pressures, explained by William Deresiewicz, is the higher requirement to join a Ivy League college. In the 1979, most requirements to enter yale was a couple of resumes and average grades between an A, which was great, and a B which was considered good. In the end, small of applicants are chosen. In Deresiewicz’s day, the requirement now looks at tests score averages, GPA, class status and extracurricular activities. They also look at essays of applicants who want join. Deresiewicz states that “Superhumans” are most likely to catch the eye Ivy colleges. Another change in college pressures is the change in purpose. In 1979, most students focus on what they what to do with their lives. Nowadays students purpose is to get into the college they want and pass, but fail at understand after college.
ReplyDeleteMy opinion is that ASU doesn’t fall under any of Deresiewicz’s categories of college pressures. Sure, I still have different pressures that can give me stress, but that can be said for all ASU students. ASU doesn’t have a high requirement as Yale but their still is big requirement. ASU also helps student by offering some jobs to students with their major. Not much I can say because I only been in this college for three semesters and I don’t feel the pressure of it.
Not a lot of changes have happened since Zinsser wrote his essay in 1979. According to Deresiewicz, college pressure in Yale University and other pristine colleges have changed. Both essays express how there's so much more pressure than before, whether it is a parental pressure, a team pressure, economically pressured or peer pressure. Both essays also describe changes in ways the students are thinking. Students are becoming more worried about the courses they need to take and "what is the best route" and basically wanting a map and steps. Instead of exploring and becoming a well-rounded person and truly understanding a subject or thing.
ReplyDeleteI would say that at Angelo state university student's pressure would fall into the same categories as the students' pressures described in the two essays, however, it would fall under different categories as well. The students at Ivy league colleges have the same amount of pressure but on a higher level than regular colleges. Higher pristine colleges tend to be more strict and more intense because most of their students come from rich families and those students tend to stress more. Both of these universities fall under the same amount of work and studying and managing hours.
In the passages “College Pressure” by William Zinsser and “Don’t Send Your Kid to Ivy League” by William Deresiewicz both talk about college pressure. According to Zinsser there are 4 types of college pressure. They are economic pressure, parental pressure, peer pressure, and self-induced pressure. Of course they all work in their own way but together they can be straining on a college student. The way the pressure of college has changed is that it is more now self-induced pressure and peer pressure rather than all four of them being equal. I say this because if a student has been accepted into an Ivy League school like Yale or Harvard then there is a good chance that they don’t have to worry about the economic side of paying for the college. This is because most student who do make it into those schools means that their parents are very wealthy and donate a lot into the school. Now piggy backing off of that since their parents are donating a lot in to the school and considering that it is an Ivy League school that the student made it into then the parent really isn’t pressuring the kid to make good grades since the kid has been making good grades he or she whole life since they obviously made it into the Ivy League school.
ReplyDeleteIn my opinion the college pressures we have here at Angelo State are somewhat lighter compared to an Ivy League school. I say this because Angelo State is a realitvly cheap school and there aren’t many hard classes here supposed to Yale. Now on the other hand if kids here are anything like me then they do suffer from parental pressure. Being that their parents are paying a couple thousand based on your tuition and the scholarships you’ve earned they do want you to try and pass your class with all A’s and B’s so you can get more money from the college. Also I would say that peer pressure is a big thing for a small college like Angelo State. Partly because San Angelo is not that big of a town and there isn’t very much to keep students occupied. So of course they might fall under the influence of doing drugs and could possibly be pressured to do them because they want to fit in here and make new friends.
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
ReplyDelete